Philzone.org Discussion Board: Archive 2004: Politics Archive 2004: What Vermont and South Carolina might soon have in common

Blue State Secession
by KIRKPATRICK SALE

In the shadow of the election that returned to power the most autocratic and illegitimate government the nation has ever experienced, many are beginning to talk about "blue state" secession. Most of the talk has seemed frivolous, but over the weekend of November 5-7 in Middlebury, Vermont, three dozen people met to discuss and promote--seriously--the prospect of secession from the United States.

The three days of speeches, presentations and debate were sponsored by the Fourth World, an organization based in England devoted to the separatist movements working for independence within the other three "worlds," and by the Second Vermont Republic, a grassroots movement that is ardently working for the state to become a republic, as it was from 1777 to 1791 (www.vermontrepublic.org). It is safe to say that not many people knew such organizations even existed, but the passion and earnestness of the weekend's deliberations showed there is a real feeling that consideration of such an extreme measure as secession is not beyond the pale.

"I think November 7 was a watershed occasion," said Thomas Naylor, a retired Duke University economics professor who has lived in Vermont for a decade and is the founder of the Second Vermont Republic. "We've put the idea of secession into the public arena and found it has a lot of resonance." Indeed, the local Rutland Herald gave the conference a prominent fourteen-paragraph story ("Secession enthusiasts meet in Middlebury"). The leading French daily in Quebec did a front-page story on the meeting (naturally, it liked the idea).

The pattern of the meeting, billed as a "Radical Consultation," was to consider the options open to people wanting to challenge and change the current American empire and to test the viability of what might be put in its place, especially if, as the call for the conference argued, "it has most probably become unsustainable economically, politically, militarily, agriculturally, socially, culturally, and environmentally." Among the options considered and rejected were denial, compliance, reform and revolution, leaving the discussion to concentrate on decentralization, separatism and secession.

A statement signed by most of the participants gives a sense of where that discussion led: "In our deliberations we have considered many kinds of strategies for a new politics and eventually decided upon the inauguration of a campaign to monitor, study, promote and develop agencies of separatism," meaning "all the forms by which small political bodies distance themselves from larger ones...creating small and independent states that rule themselves."

The statement went on to argue that "there is no reason that we cannot begin to examine the process of secession in the United States." It cited twenty-eight separatist organizations already operating in this country, including those in Alaska, Hawaii, Texas and Puerto Rico, in addition to Vermont. "The principle of secession," it said, "must be established as valid and legitimate."

The model of secession put forth by the Second Republic people was specifically endorsed by the meeting. That group has been working for a year and a half and has issued a Vermont constitution, a bill of rights and a 128-page manifesto arguing that secession is in fact legal under the US Constitution and that "all American states have a moral and legal right to leave the Union." They believe that "a peaceful, democratic, grassroots, libertarian populist" approach can indeed make great inroads.

The conference also specifically endorsed an effort to establish a think tank to examine issues of sovereignty, independence and secession, and to create a journal that would explore popular and scholarly approaches to this area.

In a dark time of rampant "political capital" Bushism there are still people willing to shine a different light, and in that context the idea of separatism and secessionism might have a real attraction to disaffected Americans.



Stranger things have happened....

Secession is for pussies!

If they take Phish with them I'll help Vermont pack! Or,

People who secede just want to be noticed

lol

we vermonters have always been prospecting secession ever since we lost it in 1791. popularity in such matters is simply growing as more individuals, particularly outside of vermont, weigh the potential possibilities and begin to expand their historical perspective. perhaps the only shared characteristic between texas and vermont is our historical strive for true independence, resulting in the formation of an independent republic. up here, a popular alternative to simple secession from the united states would be to join quebec as they have been striving for independence from canada for sometime. french canadian mostly dislike dubya as well an account for a large minority up here in vermont.



i believe if vermont were to attempt to secede, again, dubya would send in the clowns, i mean, army, and that would be the end of that.
peace in the east!

pussies?

vermont has sent more soldiers into harms way for dubya's pointless invasion than any other state, speaking in terms of state population. 420 men and women as of today.

pussies?

dubya and his tight circle of chicken hawks are the pussies my friends!

>>>>vermont has sent more soldiers into harms way for dubya's pointless invasion than any other state, speaking in terms of state population. 420 men and women as of today.

And does that really matter when you take a step back and wonder...would those 420 men -and womem??- be holler'an "simple secession from the united states"...somehow, I find that hard to believe.

Speaking in terms of state population..there are more men and woman sacrificing their lives, in a war YOU don't believe in, than any other state.
And????

>>> there are more men and woman sacrificing their lives, in a war YOU don't believe in, than any other state. <<<


the more things change...

Ok, Seija, once more unto the breach...

Why do YOU support this war? Give me some examples of what it will achieve. We wont even worry about the bogus reasoning that the WH fed to the American people - just tell us what you think it will do to protect Americans.

thanks.

it all must end.

what does it mean when our nations administration says it will hunt-down and nuetrulize religious fundamentalism throughout the world, all the while, practicing christian fundamentalism themselves right here in america.

islamic fundamentalism = christian fundamentalism = acts of extreme inhumanity

keep common sense alive, keep peace alive.

Secession only leads to dead vermonters
bad idea

I do not see it happening in this diabolical government we so wrongly state is democratic. We right now have a tyrant whose buddies are leaving the ship of fools. Yet as you see their are more idiots signing on! If this were the free country we try to shove up everyone else's noses then we wouldnot have to think about pulling out. Go for it states...I just cannot see where any southern state would since they voted for the Inbred Idiot we have running this anti Christ Government. I obey God's Laws. He is the one in charge! And He will deal with all the pretend Christians! We were given a head to use it wisely,a heart to use benevolently, and a soul to remember who is in charge when we go to meet our maker! Jesus never made a religion, man did. Jesus was here to remind us that we are all living on God's Planet, to do so wisely, not to abuse His trust. Man made religion, man made governments that is why they are not perfect. God made the planets, stars, creatures. Unfortunately we evolved, it has been Hell ever since. We destroy everything we touch!

Lavabrain - what part of Vermont are ye in?

I'm in Waterbury.

hows it going #6(Theprisoner), i'm from franklin county. have you been to the alchemist, supposedly good food and even better beer?
peace..